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Author Topic: Questions about naval warfare during 1991 conflict.  (Read 18655 times)
 
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lupodimare89
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« on: June 10, 2017, 12:14:06 pm »

Hello. Some  time ago i posted topic concerning the naval warfare of partisans during ww2.

I wanted to make some questions concerning Yugoslavian and Croat naval actions during the 1991-1992.
Every contribution/reply is welcome in addition to link or pages who could explains a bit more.

Here the list of detailed questions:

1) Identity of Yugoslavian ships that sunk on 9-12 November 1991 (unclear exact day) the ferry "Adriatic" and the American-owned sailing ship "Pelagic" in Dubrovnik.
It is also possible ships were attacked by anti-tank missiles.

2) Identity of Yugoslavian ship that intercepted and sunk the Maltese-flagged ship "Euro River" manned by croats attempting to break the Dubrovnik blockade, nearby Solta Island.

3) Identification of Yugoslavian ships that caused minor damages to ferries "Bartol Kasic" and "Vladimir Nazor" during the Battle of Dalmatian Channels.
(possibly it was frigate Split of tactical group "Kastala").

4) Exact date when the Croat runabout "Sveti Vlaho" met a Yugoslavian patrol boat/gunboat causing her temporary grounding. Also identity of the Yugoslavian warship and general details of the engagement (There was a gunfight?).


5) Knowledge of other clashes/seizures or sinking occurred between 1991 and 1992

 

 
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lupodimare89
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« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2017, 12:09:03 pm »

There is really no one who could help me?  Sad
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HrcAk47
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« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2017, 12:37:20 pm »

Hello. Some  time ago i posted topic concerning the naval warfare of partisans during ww2.

I wanted to make some questions concerning Yugoslavian and Croat naval actions during the 1991-1992.
Every contribution/reply is welcome in addition to link or pages who could explains a bit more.

Here the list of detailed questions:

1) Identity of Yugoslavian ships that sunk on 9-12 November 1991 (unclear exact day) the ferry "Adriatic" and the American-owned sailing ship "Pelagic" in Dubrovnik.
It is also possible ships were attacked by anti-tank missiles.

2) Identity of Yugoslavian ship that intercepted and sunk the Maltese-flagged ship "Euro River" manned by croats attempting to break the Dubrovnik blockade, nearby Solta Island.

3) Identification of Yugoslavian ships that caused minor damages to ferries "Bartol Kasic" and "Vladimir Nazor" during the Battle of Dalmatian Channels.
(possibly it was frigate Split of tactical group "Kastala").

4) Exact date when the Croat runabout "Sveti Vlaho" met a Yugoslavian patrol boat/gunboat causing her temporary grounding. Also identity of the Yugoslavian warship and general details of the engagement (There was a gunfight?).


5) Knowledge of other clashes/seizures or sinking occurred between 1991 and 1992

 

 

Unfortunately, all discussion of events pertaining to the Yugoslav Civil Wars (1991-1995) are strictly sanctioned by the Article 11 of the Forum Rules.

While there is a number of interesting military topics that could stem from the subject, they all inevitably devolve into a sh*tshow of ad hominems, without exception. Therefore, all such discussion is to be done through private messages. You could try PMing some of the more knowledgeable people. I can not help you unfortunately, I am more of a land forces kind of guy.  laugh
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lupodimare89
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« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2017, 04:43:48 pm »

Hello. Some  time ago i posted topic concerning the naval warfare of partisans during ww2.

I wanted to make some questions concerning Yugoslavian and Croat naval actions during the 1991-1992.
Every contribution/reply is welcome in addition to link or pages who could explains a bit more.

Here the list of detailed questions:

1) Identity of Yugoslavian ships that sunk on 9-12 November 1991 (unclear exact day) the ferry "Adriatic" and the American-owned sailing ship "Pelagic" in Dubrovnik.
It is also possible ships were attacked by anti-tank missiles.

2) Identity of Yugoslavian ship that intercepted and sunk the Maltese-flagged ship "Euro River" manned by croats attempting to break the Dubrovnik blockade, nearby Solta Island.

3) Identification of Yugoslavian ships that caused minor damages to ferries "Bartol Kasic" and "Vladimir Nazor" during the Battle of Dalmatian Channels.
(possibly it was frigate Split of tactical group "Kastala").

4) Exact date when the Croat runabout "Sveti Vlaho" met a Yugoslavian patrol boat/gunboat causing her temporary grounding. Also identity of the Yugoslavian warship and general details of the engagement (There was a gunfight?).


5) Knowledge of other clashes/seizures or sinking occurred between 1991 and 1992

 

 

Unfortunately, all discussion of events pertaining to the Yugoslav Civil Wars (1991-1995) are strictly sanctioned by the Article 11 of the Forum Rules.

While there is a number of interesting military topics that could stem from the subject, they all inevitably devolve into a sh*tshow of ad hominems, without exception. Therefore, all such discussion is to be done through private messages. You could try PMing some of the more knowledgeable people. I can not help you unfortunately, I am more of a land forces kind of guy.  laugh


Hello and thank you for your reply! Yeah, I guessed it could be a big reason of issue, but I wanted stress only the purely interest in naval warfare avoid of political debate.

I will try to contact few, but will more likely hope some will contact me ^^ (even if one read this post after XX months, I will still likely on the internet lol).





I will adds few extra questions, so they are all gathered and easy to read:

5-2) Details and date about the rumored attack by Croat torpedo boat "Vukovar" against Yugoslavian frigate "Split".

6) Exact date (late1991?) and details of Yugoslavian landing boat "Ugor" damaged by anti-tank rocket fire. To my knowledge, no proper amphibious ship with such name should have existed. It was a converted vessel?

7) Exact date (unclear-1991?) of damage by mine inflicted to Yugoslavian minesweeper Gradats.
How croats laid mines? Some specific unit involved as minelayer?  Also what it was class of "Gradats"? (i know 2 ships with such name).

Cool Exact date (1991?) of sinking by mine of one Yugoslavian supply-boat. Identity of ship is unknown to me.
Obviously no knowledge about Croat minelayer unit.

9) Details about the loss of croat diving support boat BRM-42 sunk by mine on 28 January 1992.
BRM-42 was used as minesweeper at the time of sinking? And how the mine was laid? (minelayer unit etc...)

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Boro Prodanic
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« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2017, 08:53:22 pm »

Dear @Lupodimare89, I am very glad to answer you, but I do not know anything about your questions, although I was an officer in Yugoslav Navy at this period... You know, it was very strange kind of war, everyone had his own unit, problems, we were living day by day and expecting some kind of solution of this strange situation... Also, we were worried about our families, because, actually our wives and children were living at enemy`s territory (my unit was located in Pula, northern Adriatic)...

We, retired naval officers have regularly monthly meetings here in Belgrade, so I will ask my friends if someone have some information of topics you asked about. If I find something, you will get information on PM.

Best regards! Boro
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lupodimare89
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« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2017, 01:37:51 pm »

Dear @Lupodimare89, I am very glad to answer you, but I do not know anything about your questions, although I was an officer in Yugoslav Navy at this period... You know, it was very strange kind of war, everyone had his own unit, problems, we were living day by day and expecting some kind of solution of this strange situation... Also, we were worried about our families, because, actually our wives and children were living at enemy`s territory (my unit was located in Pula, northern Adriatic)...

We, retired naval officers have regularly monthly meetings here in Belgrade, so I will ask my friends if someone have some information of topics you asked about. If I find something, you will get information on PM.

Best regards! Boro

Thank you very much and there is no rush  because my interest is purely for hobby/amateour research !

Have a nice summer ^^
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Mediteran
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« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2020, 03:00:25 am »

5-2) Details and date about the rumored attack by Croat torpedo boat "Vukovar" against Yugoslavian frigate "Split".
Torpedo boat "Vukovar" is Yugoslav navy torpedo boat "TC-222 PartizanII" build by licence from soviet union in Yugoslav shipyard NATO designation "Shershen", captured by Croatian terrorist in Sibenik shipyard during summer 1991. Operationaly never used , becaused the situation you described is happened in November 1991 , when this boat was out of use.


6) Exact date (late1991?) and details of Yugoslavian landing boat "Ugor" damaged by anti-tank rocket fire. To my knowledge, no proper amphibious ship with such name should have existed. It was a converted vessel?

PO-92 Ugor

7) Exact date (unclear-1991?) of damage by mine inflicted to Yugoslavian minesweeper Gradats.
How croats laid mines? Some specific unit involved as minelayer?  Also what it was class of "Gradats"? (i know 2 ships with such name).

Gradac was Jadrolinija ferry , usually keeping the line to the island of Hvar before the war , he laid mines in front of Lora naval harbour without any damage.

9) Details about the loss of croat diving support boat BRM-42 sunk by mine on 28 January 1992.
BRM-42 was used as minesweeper at the time of sinking? And how the mine was laid? (minelayer unit etc...)

BRM-42 sunk in begining of December 1991 , because they where demining mines from Gradac , why they said it happend in January , thats question for some other people. I personaly whitnes explosion.




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kosmonaut
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« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2020, 10:05:28 am »

5-2) Details and date about the rumored attack by Croat torpedo boat "Vukovar" against Yugoslavian frigate "Split".
Torpedo boat "Vukovar" is Yugoslav navy torpedo boat "TC-222 PartizanII" build by licence from soviet union in Yugoslav shipyard NATO designation "Shershen", captured by Croatian terrorist in Sibenik shipyard during summer 1991. Operationaly never used , becaused the situation you described is happened in November 1991 , when this boat was out of use.


6) Exact date (late1991?) and details of Yugoslavian landing boat "Ugor" damaged by anti-tank rocket fire. To my knowledge, no proper amphibious ship with such name should have existed. It was a converted vessel?

PO-92 Ugor

7) Exact date (unclear-1991?) of damage by mine inflicted to Yugoslavian minesweeper Gradats.
How croats laid mines? Some specific unit involved as minelayer?  Also what it was class of "Gradats"? (i know 2 ships with such name).

Gradac was Jadrolinija ferry , usually keeping the line to the island of Hvar before the war , he laid mines in front of Lora naval harbour without any damage.

9) Details about the loss of croat diving support boat BRM-42 sunk by mine on 28 January 1992.
BRM-42 was used as minesweeper at the time of sinking? And how the mine was laid? (minelayer unit etc...)

BRM-42 sunk in begining of December 1991 , because they where demining mines from Gradac , why they said it happend in January , thats question for some other people. I personaly whitnes explosion.





captured by Croatian terrorist in Sibenik Huh?!!!?Huh??!!!!!!!  WTF
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Mediteran
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« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2020, 04:37:30 pm »

1955 was built at Sweden with name KALMARSUND VII, Swedish flag
1972 new owner Jadrolinija, new name GRADAC, Croatian flag
1994 sold to Italy for breaking up at Chioggi

Gradac
(Jadrolinija: 1972-1994)
 
407 gross tons - 42m long - Nohab-Polar diesels total 897 kw - 9 knots - 350 passengers - 50 cars

During 70´s ferry was modified with two parallel railways for mine laying , all in accordance with Yugoslavian people defence policy , as per that he was naval reserve minlayer.



* gradac1.jpg (73.9 KB, 750x468 - viewed 28 times.)

* GRADAC-01_b.jpg (112.11 KB, 900x623 - viewed 29 times.)

* kalmarsund_VII_1955_01_b.jpg (87.34 KB, 695x486 - viewed 29 times.)
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Mediteran
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« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2020, 04:30:31 pm »

1955 was built at Sweden with name KALMARSUND VII, Swedish flag
1972 new owner Jadrolinija, new name GRADAC, Croatian flag
1994 sold to Italy for breaking up at Chioggi

Gradac
(Jadrolinija: 1972-1994)
 
407 gross tons - 42m long - Nohab-Polar diesels total 897 kw - 9 knots - 350 passengers - 50 cars

During 70´s ferry was modified with two parallel railways for mine laying , all in accordance with Yugoslavian people defence policy , as per that he was naval reserve minelayer.
Croatian terrorists captured mines in yugoslav people army naval storage depot in Seget-Vranjic close to the city of Trogir, when one officer betrayed his oath and let whole depot surrender to croatian terrorists.


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brodarski
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« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2020, 04:47:19 pm »

Koji hrvatski teroristi? Bili smo i ostali ZNG i HV.  Borili smo se za slobodu domovine. Toliko od mene.
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Jester
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« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2020, 09:48:45 pm »

@brodarski

Ne vataj se na baketinu 
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Mediteran
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« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2020, 10:32:36 pm »

Terrorism is the unlawful use of force or violence against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a government or its citizens to further certain political or social objectives. Law enforcement generally recognizes two types of terrorism: domestic and international.
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