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Author Topic: Kupovina i prodaja borbenih aviona sirom sveta  (Read 87388 times)
 
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MOTORISTA
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« Reply #525 on: May 15, 2018, 08:21:35 am »

Finska traži ponudu za nove borbene avione kojima bi zamenila postojeću flotu od 64 letelice Boing F/A-18C/D koji treba da ostanu u naoružanju do kraja 2025. godine. Sam posao je vredan 10 Mld.$ od kojih 30% mora da se vrati državi kroz razne ofset programe. Na ponudu su se već javili standardni ponuđači sa svojim proizvodima F/A-18E/F, F-35A, Gripen E, Rafale i Typhoon.

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Finland seeks bids for €10bn fighter jet purchase
24.04.2018.

A massive investment in new warplanes must be made in the next few years – but a possible announcement about a new joint venture option at this week’s Berlin Air Show could complicate Finland’s decision.

Finnish officials are about to send out requests for bids for one of the country’s biggest investments ever: some 7-10 billion euros to buy multi-role fighter aircraft. They are to replace the current ageing fleet of 64 F/A-18 Hornet jets.

Yle has learned that letters will be sent imminently to five airplane manufacturers asking for bids. It will be up to the next government, set to take office next spring, to decide which type of aircraft to procure.

The five planes now in the running include three from EU companies and two from the United States: the British-made Eurofighter Typhoon, France’s Dassault Rafale, Sweden’s Saab Gripen E and the US planes Boeing F/A-18 Super Hornet and Lockheed Martin F-35.

The selection also includes many other elements, including assembly, interoperability, operating systems and weapons. And the impact will reach far into the future, as Finland hopes to use the new planes into the 2050s.

Sticker price only 1/3 of total investment

The purchase price of 7-10 billion euros will probably only represent about one third of the overall costs to be incurred during the airplanes’ lifetime. The cost of buying, maintaining and upgrading the aircraft will depend partly on how many of Finland’s allies and neighbours are using the same model.

"The more users there are, the more opportunities there are to find other countries with interests similar to those of Finland,” says Jyri Raitasalo, Military Professor of War Studies at the Finnish National Defence University.

The security policy stand of the other nations using the same plane is also a relevant question, particularly for the politicians who are setting Finland’s policy and will decide on the procurement in the early 2020s.

Trump erroneously announced Hornet buy

Yle has learned that Finnish defence officials have been closely monitoring the progress of the Gripen E, made by neighbouring Sweden – a close ally which, like Finland, has an ‘enhanced membership’ in NATO’s Partnership for Peace programme.

The latest version of the plane, known as the Gripen JAS 39E/F, was first tested last year. So far fewer than 100 of the planes have been sold, only to Sweden and Brazil.

In comparison, the American planes are sold in vast numbers and are assured of a long future. For instance the US Navy plans to fly Boeing’s Super Hornets into the 2040s, so service and support for the planes will not be phased out anytime soon.

Rival Lockheed Martin, meanwhile, has sold fewer than 300 of its F-35, but many orders for the plane are pending – including from European countries including neighbouring Norway.

During the Cold War years, non-aligned Finland sought to carefully balance military procurements from the East and West, but since the fall of the USSR, it has had a freer hand.

In 1992, Finland decided to buy Boeing Hornets and has been flying them since 1995, the year it joined the EU. So clearly they would be strong contenders to replace the existing fleet.

However last August President Sauli Niinistö hastened to deny a claim by US President Donald Trump that Finland would buy new Boeing fighter jets.

New Eurofighter on the horizon?

Meanwhile the fighter jet sector may be shaken up by France and Germany’s plans to team up to produce a new type of Eurofighter jet. So far there is only a political plan, not an actual industrial venture.

Yle has learned from French sources that the two countries plan to make a major joint announcement about military aviation at the Berlin Air Show, which opens on Wednesday.

French reports indicate it could replace both the Rafale and the current Eurofighter. However no new French-German Eurofighter is expected before 2035. Therefore it is unclear how the plan might affect Finland, which needs new aircraft by the middle of the next decade, says Raitasalo. There are also reports that Sweden’s Saab might join a new Eurofighter project.

All the candidate planes are now at the same starting line, says Lauri Puranen, who is coordinating the project at the Defence Ministry. He says it is important that other countries besides Finland will be using the planes through their entire lifespan.

"It is difficult to say, for instance, whether this European venture will bring uncertainty,” Puranen says.

Source: www.yle.fi
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kosmonaut
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« Reply #526 on: May 15, 2018, 12:36:13 pm »

Ne mogu da  vjerujem da im je Boing F/A-18C/D vec za zamjene?!
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« Reply #527 on: May 15, 2018, 03:36:34 pm »

Ne mogu da  vjerujem da im je Boing F/A-18C/D vec za zamjene?!

Зар то нису амерички авиони који, као што знамо, могу да лете деценијама... (па их мало погледају, па опет деценијама)?!
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MOTORISTA
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« Reply #528 on: May 15, 2018, 08:11:15 pm »

Jbg, 2025 će napuniti okruglo 30 leta. osim toga zamena za nove je dobar biznis. Wink
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« Reply #529 on: May 15, 2018, 08:16:57 pm »

30 ? još su tu mladi avioni, šta znaju oni kako se tehnika koristi Smiley
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dzumba
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« Reply #530 on: May 21, 2018, 05:58:17 pm »

Финска... има се може се....Није то Балкан где се набавка старих авиона проглашава за посао века.
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« Reply #531 on: May 21, 2018, 06:08:18 pm »

I na vreme. 7 godina je sasvim dobar period da se sve to uradi kako treba.
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MOTORISTA
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« Reply #532 on: May 22, 2018, 06:11:01 am »

Ti avioni su, cenim, dobro održavani i velika je verovatnoća da će ih finci prodati nekome ko već koristi taj tip letelica ili nekome ko hoće da se "osavremeni" svoje RV. Možda ih prodaju Bugarskoj ili Ukrajini ili kome god. Uglavnom će zaraditi na njema neki dinar, a s druge strane će sebi kupiti nove letelice.
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« Reply #533 on: May 26, 2018, 10:07:32 am »

Kanada je firmi Leonardo dodelila ugovor vredan 1Mld.$ za nabavku sedam novih letelica AW-101 Merlin i modernizaciju postojećih 14 letelica CH-149 Kormoran, koji su kanadska verzija Merlina.

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Canadian award to Leonardo undercuts Sikorsky’s helo offer
25.05.2018.

Leonardo will upgrade 14 CH-149 Cormorant helicopters for the Canadian government.

VICTORIA, British Columbia ― The Canadian government will begin negotiations with Leonardo for a modernization program for search and rescue helicopters, undercutting a competing effort by Sikorsky.

Leonardo will be awarded a sole-source contract to upgrade 14 CH-149 Cormorant helicopters, which will cost the government more than $1 billion, Canada announced Thursday.

The aircraft have been operated by the Royal Canadian Air Force for search and rescue missions since the year 2000. AgustaWestland, a subsidiary of Leonardo, originally built the helicopters.

“The Cormorant Mid-Life Upgrade project will extend rotary-wing SAR services to at least 2040 by upgrading the existing CH-149 Cormorants and augmenting the fleet size,” Department of National Defence spokeswoman Ashley Lemire said.

Up to seven additional AW101 helos, of which the Cormorant is a variant, will be acquired, she added.

The move undercuts recent efforts by Sikorsky to convince Canada to buy its civilian S-92 helicopters for search and rescue, instead of embarking on the modernization plan.

The Air Force is now studying whether to buy AW101s, lease them or put into service the former U.S. presidential helicopters that Canada purchased in 2011 for spare parts. Those VH-71 helicopters are also a variant of the AW101.

The Canadian military acquired nine VH-71s plus spare parts from the U.S. after then-President Barack Obama pulled the plug on the expensive project and the White House decided not to use the helicopters at all.

Lemire said the Cormorant helicopter upgrade project also includes the purchase of a CH-149 simulator, updated training devices, publications and infrastructure to support the training of aircrew and maintainers for the modernized aircraft. Specific costs are still to be worked out, but the project is estimated to be more than $1 billion.

“Capability enhancements will include replacement and modernization of avionic, communication and sensor system components,” Lemire explained. “Other upgrades including replacement of older systems and new systems that improve operational effectiveness may be considered following further industry consultation.”

Lemire said acquiring a simulator will also cut down on training costs since Air Force crews are currently sent to the United Kingdom for helicopter training involving simulators.


Izvor: www.defencenews.com
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« Reply #534 on: May 27, 2018, 07:44:49 pm »

Amerikanci ne daju F 35, Turci se okreću ka Su 57
NovostiOnline   27. maj 2018.

Turski list „Jeni safak“ piše da će Turska, najverovatnije, kupiti ruske lovaca Su-57, ako SAD obustave isporuku lovaca pete generacije F-35, čime bi „kaznile“ Ankaru zbog kupovine ruskih protivvazdušnih raketnih sistema S-400.

U članku se navodi da je isporuka prvih aviona F-35 Turskoj, koja je članica NATO-a, bila planirana za jun 2018. godine. Međutim, sudeći po svemu, ona će biti zakomplikovana i odložena. Kada bi avioni Su-57 mogli da budu isporučeni Turskoj nije jasno. Te lovce za sada ne koristi ni ruska vojska, oni su tek na testiranju. Podsetimo, na današnji dan, Izrael je jedina država na Bliskom istoku koja ima na F-35. Osim toga, izraelska vojska je prva armija u svetu koja koristi te avione tokom borbenih operacija. Turska se nalazi na spisku država koje su učestvovale u finansiranju rada na stvaranju F-35. Osim SAD, na tom spisku su i Velika Britanija, Italija, Holandija, Kanada, Norveška, Australija i Danska. Izrael je imao puni pristup informacijama o konstrukciji aviona, nakon što je 2003. godine platio 20 miliona dolara.

Izvor: www.novosti.rs
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« Reply #535 on: May 27, 2018, 08:16:06 pm »

Neće oni dobiti ni SU-57. Jedan od razloga što se indija povukla iz tog programa je i mala proizvodnja koja je planirana u prvim godinama. E sad da li će Rusi usporiti opremanje svoje avijacije da bi pridobili Erdogana to je nepoznanica na koju će nam odgovor dati vreme.
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« Reply #536 on: May 27, 2018, 08:51:22 pm »

U pitanju su veliki novci i geostrateške igre i igrice.Neće se ameri lako odreći da Im se ovakav mastan  ''zalogaj''sklizne sa udice,pogotovu što program F35 guta novac kao da ga bacaju na lomaču.I na kraju imaju li SAD i Turska alternative-prvi daa nađe novijii kupac-a takvih teško da ih ima--a drugi da nađu alternativni avion te generacije u fazi opertivne upotrebe?Možda grešim??
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« Reply #537 on: May 27, 2018, 09:42:55 pm »

Mislim da i ameri imaju problema sa količinama koje mogu da proizvedu tako da im je ovo tursko zaoštravanje došlo kao kec na jedanaest.

Što se tiče turske ona navodno ravija svoj avion 5. generacije i to čistokrvni lovac, pa ako su sposobni to da naprave ne vidim što ne  bi avion kao što je F-35.

Džaba pare kada ameri imaju ograničenu proizvodnju. Oni već imaju naručenih 2500 za SAD i oko 700 (doduše nisam proveravao da li su svima njima i odobrili isporuku) za izvoz ne računajući oko 100 aviona koje je i turska izrazila želju da kupi. Do sada su proizveli nekih 250 aviona a pun potencijal proizvodnja će dostići tek u 2020. godini. Prošle godine su proizveli 66, za ovu najavljuju 90 nisam uspeo da nađem na koliko ciljaju u toj 2020. godini. Ali očigledno će isporuka ovih već poručenih trajati bar destak godina. I sad ako ameri treba da biraju da li da recimo što pre opreme Izrael, Japan i J. Koreji ili Tursku na drugoj strani jasno je zašto su tako olako odustali od prodaje Turskoj.
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« Reply #538 on: May 27, 2018, 09:49:51 pm »

Турска је партнер 3. нивоа у том програму. Ипак су дали неке паре за развој.
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« Reply #539 on: May 28, 2018, 07:49:25 pm »

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Oni već imaju naručenih 2500 za SAD i oko 700 (doduše nisam proveravao da li su svima njima i odobrili isporuku) za izvoz ne računajući oko 100 aviona koje je i turska izrazila želju da kupi.

Пре ће бити да се цифра од 2500 ком ових авиона односи на жеље (потребе), него на реалне уговоре о набавци. Ако производе 100 ком годишње онда ће им требати 25 година да испоруче све оно што је наводно наручено. Дотле ће се много што шта променити и у захтевима за набавком и у технологији, а вероватно и на пољу употребе (ратне употребе ових авиона).

Авиони се праве за паре. Зато не верујем да ће се САД баш тако лако одрећи Турске, односно њихове набавке. Евентуално прелазак Турске на набавку Су-57 био би велики ударац за престиж САД.
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