PALUBA

English Language Discussion => Forum za traženje pomoći na stranom jeziku => Topic started by: Dili on September 02, 2009, 04:03:57 pm



Title: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: Dili on September 02, 2009, 04:03:57 pm
Gentlemen sorry to be in english. Form my search Galeb class had 90mm AA gun, the recoil compensators are over the tubes in 83.5mm and below in 90mm.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: Rade on September 02, 2009, 04:24:55 pm
Galeb arrived with 90 mm guns. They were changed later.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: Dili on September 02, 2009, 06:15:46 pm
I never saw a photo of them with 83,5 mm. Do you have any?

I also have a reference that they came without armament from Germany.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: Dreadnought on September 02, 2009, 06:33:17 pm
Hi Dili  :) I have info that minelawyer's of the class "Jastreb" were equipted with 90mm guns at the bigining of there service in JKRM. Just after fue years, ships are rearmed with 83,5 mm guns ...

This is a first arnament ... 90mm gun.
[attachment=3]

Here is a foto of minelawyer "Jastreb" in early 20-is ...
[attachment=1]

close-up of the same foto ...
[attachment=2]


I hope that this can help you!

Kind regards!



Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: Dili on September 02, 2009, 06:42:54 pm
Thanks dreadnought. I know the 90mm gun, i also have a photo of it,  now i just need a photo of them with 83,5mm to give it a rest. The Jastreb photo in this thread also have the 90mm.

Regards



Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: Dreadnought on September 02, 2009, 07:00:51 pm
Here is 83,5mm gun foto!

[attachment=1]



Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: Dili on September 02, 2009, 07:31:36 pm
Thanks. Odd i tought they had compensators above the tube, here they seem to have below. The land version have compensators above the tube.

Do you know when they replaced 90mm?

I have this screenshot from a book that list 90mm still in 1939:


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: MOTORISTA on September 02, 2009, 08:09:57 pm
The book that screnshot you got is "Vojna enciklopedija" ( Military encyclopedia). Author of that part had, probably, old data.

90 mm guns used on these ships were Škoda 9 cm PL vz. 12/20 land AA guns adapted for ships.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: Dili on September 02, 2009, 08:16:17 pm
Thanks that is the information i had too. I didn't know about the upgrade.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: MOTORISTA on September 02, 2009, 08:22:55 pm
It was hard times for our navy in 1920-es, they used anything they could.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: Dili on September 07, 2009, 04:08:04 pm
Yes and 20 years later was not better...XX Century was dreadful for Europe.

AxisForum member David Reasoner http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=157514&p=1372890#p1372890 brought an excerpt from article Warship International No.4, 1987; "Yugoslav Naval Guns and the Birth of the Yugoslav Navy 1918-41" by Dipl.-Ing. Rene Greger. about upgrade of conversion/upgrade of 90mm to 83.5mm in at least 4 of Minelayers.

Quote
From the article:

"The first Yugoslav warships in full commission weren't those taken over in March 1921, but were six ex-German minesweepers bought in Hamburg as tugs that July. They arrived in Tivat in autumn 1921, the first of them entering service several months later, carrying 90mm AA guns the Austro-Hungarian Navy in the Adriatic never knew. The history of these guns is an interesting one. First destined to be installed on heavy units which were never built, the old navy instead used them in the role of land AA pieces around main naval bases. It was via this route that several of them arrived in Boka Kotorska in 1917-18. Installed in positions occupied by Serb troops at the end of the war, they were not available for seizure by the French occupational forces, and thus became available for use on the purchased minesweepers.

Although the Skoda 90mm/45-caliber gun M.12 was a good weapon by World War I standards, a decade later it was due to be upgraded. In the meantime, the new 83.5mm gun had been introduced in the Yugoslav Royal Navy. As lack of funds prevented the purchase of new guns, and the old existing 90mm guns were in good condition, it was decided to have Skoda rework these to 83.5mm caliber instead. These reworked guns were delivered in 1931. From that time on, at least four of the Galeb class minelayers carried the reworked 83.5mm, with the remainder mounting one or two guns in their original form. This helps to explain the statements in various naval yearbooks of the thirties listing 90mm guns as late as 1941, even after the better informed editors of Weyer's had published correct information in 1939."

David

[attachment=1]


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelawyers
Post by: MOTORISTA on September 07, 2009, 07:51:44 pm
Well, after the Great War, Yugoslav Royal Navy had to start from nill. So, they were forced to grab anything they could lay there hands on. First ships were these minelayers and old KuK Kriegsmarine Torpedoboots Tb21 Star, Tb36 Uhu, Tb38 Kranich and Tb19 Kibitz that were used as minesweepers D-1, D-2, D-3 and D-4. Only when treaty of Rapal was signed in 1922, we got 12 KuK Torpedoboots.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: brodarski on September 07, 2009, 09:22:43 pm
D 2 u Šibeniku.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: Dili on September 08, 2009, 01:37:27 pm
I have read D2 was a minesweeper employed also for training. Was it also a minelayer?


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: Dili on September 08, 2009, 01:46:44 pm
Just to point out from the photo i posted above converted 90mm to 83.5mm guns have a ring in tube and it appears longer.



Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: MOTORISTA on September 09, 2009, 09:36:52 am
I have read D2 was a minesweeper employed also for training. Was it also a minelayer?

No, they were used only for training and minesweeping duties. Here are some photos of D-1 and D-2 whille still in KuK navy.

[attachment=1]

[attachment=2]


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: Dreadnought on September 09, 2009, 09:58:47 am
D2

[attachment=1]


Data of D2 published by the JFS ...

[attachment=2]


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: Dili on September 09, 2009, 03:14:09 pm
Yeah that was the information i have too. I have read that 37mm guns were taken out and it had only machine guns.

Now a photo o Sokol minelayer as Italian Eso in Tripoli January 1943 just above the Floatplane.

[attachment=1]


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: MOTORISTA on September 09, 2009, 03:27:13 pm
Excelent photo :super thank you very much.


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: Dreadnought on September 09, 2009, 03:29:52 pm
Fantastic photo ... I had never seen before ... Thank you very much :super :klap

I think this is the first color photo of that ship that I see ....


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: Dili on September 09, 2009, 03:39:56 pm
Glad you liked, i forgot to put the link  http://eleri.interfree.it/ilterzonano/Guerre/XX_secolo/Seconda%20guerra%20mondiale/Marina%20militare/SM94-12_convogli.htm


Title: Re: Royal Yugoslav navy minelayers
Post by: Dreadnought on September 09, 2009, 04:00:55 pm
This is what I call good old fashioned research ... Thanks again  ;)